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Author Topic: Meziere electric water pumps. How do they cool and hold up?  (Read 8076 times)
juiced coupe
Six figures worth of don't give a f*ck
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« Reply #30 on: September 20, 2017, 03:55:50 pm »

These big fans draw current from25 to 30 Amps, which is matter not to be overlooked. They sometimes burn the 30 Amp mega-fuse I have, and then it starts to get hot in traffic lights...

If you are blowing 30 amp fuses, you may have a problem. It actually takes a good bit more than a fuses rated amperage to blow it.

What fan/fans are you using?
What is the wiring arrangement? Wire size/length, relay size/type, fuse location, power source location?
Which type fuse holder? Inline, with the terminals in a rubber holder (most common). Or the marine type with the heavy terminals and screw type wiring connections?
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Doing more with less, or something like that.
http://sbftech.com/index.php/topic,20009.0.html

Quote from: Monte Smith
Bottom line, if it was the hot ticket, the fast guys would do it.............they don't

You might need some Titanium rods and a flow bench!  LMAO on floor

I honestly don't get it.

I'm sweating, my heart is racing, my clutch foot is twichin', and my right arm punched the computer screen doing an involentary 2-3 shift while reading all that. 
z-adamson
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« Reply #31 on: September 20, 2017, 04:46:01 pm »

the reason that WOT, therefore max engine load, is important for determining the difference between the losses is that it eliminates a variable.  the HP an engine makes isn't consistent throughout the rev range...it makes less HP at lower load.  any properly scientific test will eliminate as many variables as is reasonably possible.

if you look at the hp cost of both pump setups at a specific rpm, you will get a different reading at steady state than you will at WOT.

What variable gets eliminated when testing at WOT?

It makes less HP at lower load??? Do you mean less HP at lower RPM?

So WOT is max engine load. Pretty sure I can put my engine at WOT with no load on it at all.

Anyhow, this whole WOT idea is USELESS. It takes a certain amount of power to turn the pump. How far open the throttle plates are makes no difference in how much power it takes to spin the pump.

Sure, the amount of HP an engine makes will not be consistent throughout the RPM range, but what does that have to do with how much power it takes to spin the pump? My motorcraft pump takes about 5hp to spin at about 6000RPM. This fact does not change one bit no matter how much HP the engine makes at any RPM.........or WOT for that matter...lol
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knucklefux
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« Reply #32 on: September 20, 2017, 05:31:20 pm »

lol indeed.  you're so fucking stupid yet so full of yourself.  it really is a special kind of retardation that you have.

the reason for WOT is that you would have to test on a dyno.  in order to measure a difference, you would need for all conditions to be the same from test to test EXCEPT the thing you're changing.

so-if you checked the difference in power at 5k rpm on both pumps, you won't necessarily get accurate info unless the dyno is loading the engine the EXACT same amount.  the ONLY way to get usable data to compare which pump setup costs the least power is to run both at WOT.  also, when's the last time you saw a dyno operator test the HP of an engine at anything but WOT? 

you're making a whole heap of noise about my WOT comment in a (failed) attempt to discredit what i'm saying.  this sort of tactic is the one you resort to when you don't have any useful input, but want to participate in the conversation anyway.  i'm over it.  since this forum doesn't have an ignore function, i'm just going to ignore you myself.  it's clear that you're beyond saving.

i'm going to go yell at the wall now.  it will be more effective than trying to convince you that you don't have a clue what the fuck you're on about.
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2004 cobra-needs more boost
z-adamson
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« Reply #33 on: September 21, 2017, 04:36:38 pm »

Last I checked, the amount of HP it takes to operate a water pump comes down to the following...

Gallons per minute
Vertical distance in feet that the water is traveling
Friction losses
Pump efficiency
Specific gravity

In this case the equation would look like this...

HP = distance traveled + friction loss X gpm X specific gravity / 3960

Once those numbers are crunched, divide the outcome by the efficiency of the pump and belt drive. You now have the answer as to how much engine HP the pump is consuming.

------------------------------------

In my case, with my 347, with the pump at 6000RPM, the pump is flowing 65 GPM through the restriction of the system....not free flow.

Water has a specific gravity of 1. Ethylene glycol has a specific gravity of 1.10. A 50/50 mix gets me a specific gravity of 1.05.

There are a ton of friction losses within the block, heads, radiator, hoses. Looking at one of the many, many friction loss charts on the net, and looking at the water jackets, hoses, radiator etc... I get a value of 403.

Soooo, I get a formula that looks like this...

HP = 403 x 65 x 1.1 / 3960 = 7.2222

My belt drive with proper tension and a belt that is in good shape is 98% efficient.

So, 7.2222 / .98 = 7.3695 HP from the engine to turn my water pump at 6000RPM.

Then figure in the small amount of rolling torque it takes to overcome seal drag, bearing drag etc. within the pump.

My pump will flow 22GPM at 2000RPM, 43GPM at 4000RPM. I could calculate those out as well.



So, again, what does WOT have to do with any of this???

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knucklefux
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« Reply #34 on: September 21, 2017, 06:42:48 pm »

repeatable results on a dyno require WOT.  how is this even a thing that needs to be beaten to death?

just pretend that instead of "WOT" i said "back to back dyno pulls" and move on.  Dissapointed

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« Reply #35 on: October 30, 2017, 05:24:01 am »

The most helpful comment I saw here, 7 amps to drive a water pump to cool a car. 7 amps at 14v is about 98 watts. Lets round up to 100 watts, that's .13 hp, or about 1/7th of a hp.

2 hp for a 60 amp alt seems about right. 60 amps = about 840 watts at 14v, or about 1.13hp. Factoring in belt loss and about 65% efficiency I'd say that 2hp makes sense. Most of my stock cars only pull 20-30 amps at idle, but even still.

For me, if that electric motor dies, I probably can't get another one to get home from AutoZone. I can drive highway and baby the car city with no fan, electric or mechanical. Not so much with an electric water pump if it decides to shit the bed.

My $.02
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1986 cougar gs. 5.0 s.o. and aod.
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