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| |-+ Nitrous (Moderator: juiced coupe)
| | |-+ yay timing questions!
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Author Topic: yay timing questions!  (Read 2099 times)
302Army187
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« on: May 03, 2011, 06:55:40 am »

SO i'm already bored of the new h/c/i and ready to spray again.

I have a couple issues I'm working out before I use the nitrous. damn car is running rich for some reason. but I will be sure whatever the issue is, it will be fixed before I spray.


So I have a tune. the car has a chip in the computer. I was thinking in order to drop my timing I would have to lock the computer out by leaving the spout connector out, correct?

I don't want to risk the computer trying to use the tune, and having high timing on a 150shot.


So I was going to lock out my timing, and start low. around 28* total with timing locked, and work my way up.


what do you guys think?

I asked my tuner and he said he wasn't sure how it would act with the timing like that, and wants me to pay him to put ANOTHER tune on the car for the nitrous, and a switch, so I can switch from motor tune, to a nitrous tune.


91 octane fuel, 2 step colder plugs, if it helps.




Also, I was wondering if having a long line from the noids to the plate is a issue. I have my noids hidden in the passenger side fender, and im going to run the lines down the firewall to the back of my nitrous plate to try and hide the entire kit. Will running this, 5' of line going to be a issue? As in the nitrous will get to the motor WAY before the fuel?

Thanks
Rob
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302, stock bottom end, TF heads, TF cam, victor 5.0 efi intake a little nitrous through a plate
juiced coupe
Six figures worth of don't give a f*ck
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Location: Pascagoula, MS
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« Reply #1 on: May 03, 2011, 07:26:28 am »

On a 150 shot, I would start out with the timing locked at 25* with a -8 or -9 NGK plug (non projected).

As for the 5' jumper lines. I have seen long lines used on the nitrous side to slow the hit, but never one that long on the fuel side. I don't know, but it sounds like trouble.
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Just a 12 second car with a 11 second engine.....that runs 10s
http://sbftech.com/index.php/topic,20009.0.html

Quote from: Monte Smith
Bottom line, if it was the hot ticket, the fast guys would do it.............they don't

You might need some Titanium rods and a flow bench!  LMAO on floor
302Army187
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« Reply #2 on: May 04, 2011, 07:20:51 am »

yea, I had that thought about the jumper lines too. the guy I got the kit off of probably had 6" from the fuel noid to the plate, and 10" from the nitrous noid to the plate.


I would like to hide everything if possible, but not if its going to be a risk to the motor. I want to get into the 10's with this combo, 150 shot or 200 shot. what ever it takes.

do you have a part number on thouse plugs? and are they the right length for trickflow heads? I have autolite 3923's in the motor now I think.
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302, stock bottom end, TF heads, TF cam, victor 5.0 efi intake a little nitrous through a plate
juiced coupe
Six figures worth of don't give a f*ck
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« Reply #3 on: May 04, 2011, 11:10:14 am »

do you have a part number on thouse plugs? and are they the right length for trickflow heads? I have autolite 3923's in the motor now I think.

NGK R-5671A-8 (stock #4554) or R-5671A-9 (stock #5238). The -9 is colder. Most places will need the stock number.

yea, I had that thought about the jumper lines too. the guy I got the kit off of probably had 6" from the fuel noid to the plate, and 10" from the nitrous noid to the plate.

I would like to hide everything if possible, but not if its going to be a risk to the motor.

The longest fuel jumper line I have ever used was 18". That should be long enough to hide the solenoid out of sight. Its amazing just how much you can hide with split electrical wrap, split vacuum line, and black paint.

I want to get into the 10's with this combo, 150 shot or 200 shot. what ever it takes.

At your altitude, you would need what would be high 9 second power at sea level with a NA car. Luckily, nitrous isn't affected nearly as much by altitude as a NA combo. If the rest of the car is right, 10s shouldn't be a problem.
Logged

Just a 12 second car with a 11 second engine.....that runs 10s
http://sbftech.com/index.php/topic,20009.0.html

Quote from: Monte Smith
Bottom line, if it was the hot ticket, the fast guys would do it.............they don't

You might need some Titanium rods and a flow bench!  LMAO on floor
302Army187
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Location: Denver, Co/8,000+ DA

« Reply #4 on: May 05, 2011, 03:44:08 am »

do you have a part number on thouse plugs? and are they the right length for trickflow heads? I have autolite 3923's in the motor now I think.

NGK R-5671A-8 (stock #4554) or R-5671A-9 (stock #5238). The -9 is colder. Most places will need the stock number.

yea, I had that thought about the jumper lines too. the guy I got the kit off of probably had 6" from the fuel noid to the plate, and 10" from the nitrous noid to the plate.

I would like to hide everything if possible, but not if its going to be a risk to the motor.

The longest fuel jumper line I have ever used was 18". That should be long enough to hide the solenoid out of sight. Its amazing just how much you can hide with split electrical wrap, split vacuum line, and black paint.

I want to get into the 10's with this combo, 150 shot or 200 shot. what ever it takes.

At your altitude, you would need what would be high 9 second power at sea level with a NA car. Luckily, nitrous isn't affected nearly as much by altitude as a NA combo. If the rest of the car is right, 10s shouldn't be a problem.

Thanks for the part number. looks like thouse plugs will lower the risk of detonation. is the 9 plug colder then the 8? if so, how do they compare with the 3923's? I don't want to go TOO cold with the plugs unless you think it will benifet the safty of the motor.

good to know about the length of line. What I think I will do is try to move everything behind the intake. the car had a victor 5.0 efi intake, so I have a lot of room behind it, and I might even be able to tuck some of the stuff under the lower intake. Looks like I have some routing to do.

The plan was to use wire loom to hide every though, haha. No shady street racing is planed right now, but its an option. If i where to pop my hood, not to many people would be fooled anyhow.


i know 10's are a long shot. I think it has mid 11's on a 150 shot at my elevation, but I think even with a 200 shot, I might not run faster then low low 11's. But we will see what happens.
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302, stock bottom end, TF heads, TF cam, victor 5.0 efi intake a little nitrous through a plate
302Army187
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« Reply #5 on: May 05, 2011, 03:51:42 am »

looking on summit, it says the autolite 3923 plugs have a heat rage of "3" and the R5671A-9's have a heat rage of "9"


Not sure at all what the hell that is reletive too, haha, but seems they are very different plugs.

im assuming the R5671A-9 are MUCH MUCH "colder" then the 3923s? wouldn't that hurt me quite a bit on how much power the car is going to make, motor, or nitrous?
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302, stock bottom end, TF heads, TF cam, victor 5.0 efi intake a little nitrous through a plate
juiced coupe
Six figures worth of don't give a f*ck
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Location: Pascagoula, MS
The land mass between New Orleans and Mobile


« Reply #6 on: May 05, 2011, 12:46:46 pm »

looking on summit, it says the autolite 3923 plugs have a heat rage of "3" and the R5671A-9's have a heat rage of "9"


Not sure at all what the hell that is reletive too, haha, but seems they are very different plugs.

That is the manufacturers heat range. I means nothing when comparing two different brands. Its not even god for comparing projected to non-projected plugs of the same brand, only plugs of the same series.

im assuming the R5671A-9 are MUCH MUCH "colder" then the 3923s?

As I said, you are comparing a projected to a non-projected plug. Judging by the charts i have, its about 3 steps colder. That long electrode on a projected tip plug is the problem.

Quote from: Steve Johnson
The non projected better absorbs the heat and takes it away from the tip.. As you know, the projected tip has an electrode that's like a long wick. And as you know... wicks burn !!  SJ

wouldn't that hurt me quite a bit on how much power the car is going to make, motor, or nitrous?

How much power can you make with a hole in your piston? Oddly enough, my fastest NA times were with that same -9 plug, opposed to a 3923 that I normally ran.
Logged

Just a 12 second car with a 11 second engine.....that runs 10s
http://sbftech.com/index.php/topic,20009.0.html

Quote from: Monte Smith
Bottom line, if it was the hot ticket, the fast guys would do it.............they don't

You might need some Titanium rods and a flow bench!  LMAO on floor
juiced coupe
Six figures worth of don't give a f*ck
Global Moderator
Big Block
*****
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Posts: 6316


Location: Pascagoula, MS
The land mass between New Orleans and Mobile


« Reply #7 on: May 05, 2011, 01:18:45 pm »

Here is a pic of a Autolite 3923 when used with a 125 shot. It was with 27* of timing and low bottle pressure (forgot my heat source at home).

The heat mark is right at the base of the plug, whereas it should be at the middle of the bend. That bitch had some heat in it.

Also, that was only 1/8 mile. Another 1/8 and that plug would have been toast. If the bottle had been hot, it might not have made the first 1/8.


* 3923, 125.JPG (207.06 KB, 1024x768 - viewed 104 times.)
Logged

Just a 12 second car with a 11 second engine.....that runs 10s
http://sbftech.com/index.php/topic,20009.0.html

Quote from: Monte Smith
Bottom line, if it was the hot ticket, the fast guys would do it.............they don't

You might need some Titanium rods and a flow bench!  LMAO on floor
302Army187
Small Block
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Location: Denver, Co/8,000+ DA

« Reply #8 on: May 05, 2011, 04:46:45 pm »

good information, I thought a 3923 was a better plug, but sounds like even still it is too hot for the nitrous.

I will be sure to swap in the proper plugs when the time comes.

Gotta get everything routed and wired up first.


Also gotta find time and space to ad this to the kit

(picture is from when it was on the guys car before I bought the kit off him)
http://i44.photobucket.com/albums/f21/MPsoldier187/New%20Nitrous%20Kit/055.jpg

stand alone fuel system filled with race fuel should keep everything MUCH safer Smiley
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302, stock bottom end, TF heads, TF cam, victor 5.0 efi intake a little nitrous through a plate
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