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Author Topic: Mcleod "soft-lock" clutch  (Read 11059 times)
Antony Moore
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« on: April 02, 2008, 06:37:12 pm »

Has anyone ever ran a "soft-lock" clutch on the street? Mcleod says race only because its a sintered iron disc, I've ran a sintered iron on the street, it was limited tho, no big stop light stop and go. So I am looking at limited street duty. However, it doesn't make much sense to have a pump gas motor using a race only clutch.
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RACERX89
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« Reply #1 on: April 02, 2008, 06:43:08 pm »

Has anyone ever ran a "soft-lock" clutch on the street? Mcleod says race only because its a sintered iron disc, I've ran a sintered iron on the street, it was limited tho, no big stop light stop and go. So I am looking at limited street duty. However, it doesn't make much sense to have a pump gas motor using a race only clutch.

Then you had better order one!   Loco LMAO on floor
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Antony Moore
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« Reply #2 on: April 02, 2008, 07:16:12 pm »

Isn't your clutch sintered iron on one side?
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BirdMan
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« Reply #3 on: April 02, 2008, 08:29:49 pm »

I think that is the clutch I last used in my drag car.  Full ring of sintered iron 10.5" without cushioning springs, pp was 11" mtg with alum platen and steel face.  Adjusted down to less than 700# pp pressure.  Clutch pedal push could be a finger or two.  I had solid mtr mts both sides and std rubber trans mt.  I also used a turnbuckle attached to front of left cyl head and shock tower on '65 Falcon.  I had no clutch chatter probably because of the way I mtd it!  Don't know.  When driving to staging, returning from a run the clutch felt tight and concise, didn't feel like it would have chattered if not tied down, but who knows.  Try it, because I would like to know as I am thinking about doing the same thing when I return car to street with 6 speed.
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« Reply #4 on: April 02, 2008, 08:58:59 pm »

I'd like to know a little more about this stuff too.  From my understanding the Ram adjustable setup is surprisingly reasonable on the street, once you get used to it.  It's a full unsprung sintered iron deal as well.

Cris 
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RACERX89
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« Reply #5 on: April 02, 2008, 10:19:31 pm »

Isn't your clutch sintered iron on one side?

Yes.  Sintered on the pressure plate side and organic on the flywheel side.   When I'm
not fighting the clutch cable "issues", it seems to be an OK setup.  I did a little reading on
the "soft-lock" and I think it would be a very nice setup for what you are wanting to do. 
I dont really see anything about it, except the non-sprung disc, thats not considered
"street friendly".  With the adjustability that it offers, I dont see how you could go wrong.

From what I have read, it seems Jay is a pretty good clutch guy!  Maybe he will chime in
and give his thoughts. 

 
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Is1BadFord
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« Reply #6 on: April 02, 2008, 10:23:14 pm »

I hear they're only good for about 9000 miles?  Is this so?
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run-ne1
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« Reply #7 on: May 09, 2008, 09:55:06 pm »

Quote
I hear they're only good for about 9000 miles?  Is this so?

There are way to many factors in that to judge but I doubt i would get that kind of life out of that clutch. I would be estatic if i could. I am interested in the same kind of clutch also but was talked out of it due to time needed to spend tuning on it.
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« Reply #8 on: May 09, 2008, 10:56:11 pm »

Isn't your clutch sintered iron on one side?

 
I dont really see anything about it, except the non-sprung disc, thats not considered
"street friendly".  With the adjustability that it offers, I dont see how you could go wrong.


I believe there is a sprung version too.
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dennis112
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« Reply #9 on: May 12, 2008, 08:44:45 am »

I hear they're only good for about 9000 miles?  Is this so?

Of course you know that I am in the process of doing this "test" this year using the Ram Sintered Iron clutch setup.  Unfortunately, it might take me several years to get 9000 miles, especially since I've grown to love the track more than the street . . . . .

One thing that you also have to consider (at least with the Ram sintered iron deal) is that it uses spacer washers to set the PP away from the flywheel a certain distance.  Once you get some wear, you are supposed to re-verify against the original set up distance and then remove some of those PP washers to get back to the original measurement. 

I can verify the measurement anytime through the hole in the Scattershield that I use to make the static adjustments.

In the pic below, you can see how the measurement was taken during initial setup.  Desired distance for my clutch is 1.975 and washers are removed in .010 increments so the value you shown is good:



(Disregard the ratchet extension on the floor that looks like part of the measurement process.)
 
I started with .100" of washers to get the above measurement.  Five .010 and one .050 washers are on each of those 6 very expensive studs to maintain the same thickness all the way around the PP/clutch.  Note the stacks of washers below:



What I can't do is correct this alignment WITHOUT dropping the tranny and bellhousing in order to remove those washers.  How often you will do this will depend on how much clutch slippage you are dialing in.  Take this inconsideration if you are considering this clutch, especially for lots of street duty.

One additional note about the Ram sintered iron stuff.  The sintered iron disc friction material, which looks a lot like a sharpening stone, is very thick compared to the commonly available composition discs.  Below is what the sintered iron disc looks like when new  It has the same material and thickness on both sides:



Back to the longevity issue, I'll be pulling my PP today to send it back to Ram for that much needed CW modification.  When I drop the disc, I'll let you know how it faired after a couple hundred street miles and 25 or so quarter mile sprints with ET Drag slicks.

« Last Edit: May 12, 2008, 03:26:23 pm by dennis112 » Logged

Dennis

65' Stang, 434W NA, Victor Heads, Super Vic Intake, 11:1, Braswell Carb, Bullet SR Cam, G101A 4-Speed, 4:56 rear, 93 Octane Pump Gas  9.82@138.00
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« Reply #10 on: May 12, 2008, 10:36:23 am »

 4 Eyed,,,i want one
                           Drool
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nothing like the sound of a big hp windsor

Don't fear the gear! 


Or you can run back to FM and build a 3.00" stroke, 6.500" rod, in a 9.500" deck block, use GT-40 heads because you want "torque" and then run 13's because it won't turn the tires in wet grass.

Your Choice


Do you know how you can spot bullshit?.......... here are some catch phrases  to look for:


Torque Down Low
Velocity
Tip In
A 750 cfm Holley is too big of a carburetor
A 75mm TB is too big for an EFI N/A setup
Single Plane intakes are only good for 7000 rpm setups
A long runner EFI intake is the only alternative for a DD setup
Rod to stroke ratio and side loading
A set of cylinder heads that peak flow at .500" lift require a .500" lift cam
Solid roller setups area a Don't ...no  for streetable setups
Anything bigger than a 2.5" ID exhaust will cause losses in power, specially in "torque down low"


CI qoute of the month--

Never saw a flow bench go down the track and 10cfm in an application where the MCSA is the issue, 10cfm is like trying to piss on the World Trade Center when it was on fire.
RACERX89
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« Reply #11 on: May 12, 2008, 11:47:55 am »

   dennis112.   Thats the kind of info. I love to read.   Thanks
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dennis112
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« Reply #12 on: May 12, 2008, 01:03:02 pm »

Here is the "wear and tear" update.

I dropped the Scattershield and remeasured the PP distance and now it is 1.990.  So after 200 or so street miles and 25 runs, I am certainly due to remove a couple of washers.  Due to the nature of this disc, there was a dust coating found on various parts.  Here is the tranny snout:



Inside the scattershield:



Clutch before being disassembled from the flywheel:



A couple of pics of the sintered iron disc--it still looks good on both sides:





Now for that bad news.  I have an interesting 3 point burn pattern in both the PP and the Flywheel.  I can feel the wear in those 3 points in the flywheel, particularly at the lowest part of the contact circle.  There it is burnt blue an is a few thousands difference compared to the part of the flywheel that the clutch does not ride on.  Note that this Ram Billet steel flywheel was freshly blanchard ground at the start of the this year's race season.  Obvious it be ground again before reassembly.  As for the PP, since it is being sent back for the CW mod, it will of course also be renewed.

Here are pics of the heavy burn marks that I am describing:





As you can see (from my limited experience,) sintered iron clutches will require periodic maintenance and will not be an "install and forget it" type deal like the typical replacement clutches.  The PP will need to be measured periodically to determine clutch disc wear and you may need to remove the PP once in awhile to remove the spacing washers (at least for the Ram unit) to correct for clutch wear. This is not the same thing as doing the static adjustment which can easily be accomplished through a small opening in the scattershield with an allen head socket.

The sintered iron dust is abrasive and can affect the longevity of your pilot and your throw out bearing.  My pilot bearing is a special shielded roller bearing and my throwout bearing is the premium type that can be greased.  Luckily, those items still look good. 
« Last Edit: May 12, 2008, 03:31:17 pm by dennis112 » Logged

Dennis

65' Stang, 434W NA, Victor Heads, Super Vic Intake, 11:1, Braswell Carb, Bullet SR Cam, G101A 4-Speed, 4:56 rear, 93 Octane Pump Gas  9.82@138.00
Stephen Johnson
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« Reply #13 on: May 16, 2008, 08:53:25 am »

I run a soft loc in my daily driver, no problems at all,   I usually will leave the 3 turns in mine when I am racing it, and if i know I will not be goin racing for while and want to do some street driving i will turn it up to maxium pressure
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